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» Auction1 Trad Gang.com » Main Forums » The Bowyer's Bench » experienced bowyers - is this safe? (Page 1)

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Author Topic: experienced bowyers - is this safe?
TroyH
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I recently asked a question about wind checks (cracks from wind twisting, etc) in my stave.
I had a nice straight reflexed stave, so I went ahead and worked it down. I had hoped the checks would nearly vanish as I got down to one ring and final layout. On the contrary, they got worse.
Here are 2 pics.
This is one of the limbs.

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Here is the handle area.

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The cracks do not run off the edge at any point, but do come close. The cracks actually get larger as you go to the belly, whereas on the bows back they are simply dark lines. I guess my question is, do you think it is safe to go ahead with this bow (filling the cracks with CA glue for safety) or should I scrap it and start over?

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Formerly known as PastorHunter.

Posts: 289 | From: Williamsport, IN | Registered: Jan 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Tom Leemans
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I believe I'd pass on that stave.

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Got wood? - Tom

Posts: 4847 | From: Illinois | Registered: Mar 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Art B
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Cracks are just on the belly side, right? If so, then I personally wouldn't have a problem finishing a bow out like that. You can always add wraps (temporary wraps as you're tilleing the bow out, finished wraps when you're through) if your in doubt to the integrity of the limbs. Same with the handle area.

You won't know what you got there if you don't give it a try. ART

Posts: 1585 | From: Lansing, WVa | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
TroyH
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The cracks do go all the way through, though on the bows back they show only as dark lines. On the belly, as you can see, they actually open up as cracks.

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Formerly known as PastorHunter.

Posts: 289 | From: Williamsport, IN | Registered: Jan 2007  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Art B
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Those are longitudinal cracks and really won't hurt the integrity of the limbs. Problem is keeping the limbs together while you tiller them out. You're going to have to use temporary wraps each time you check the bow's tiller/weight and remove them to scrape/sand the limbs.

Cracks close to the edges will probably work out as you radius the belly/edges. You might try filling the cracks first with SG and clamp to see if any of the glue backs out. That will give you a better idea of just how tight the crack really are. Then fill with sanding dust as you sand the limbs.

Some nylon strapping tape would be good for a temporary wrap. Quick to apply and quick to remove. Upholstry thread makes for a nice strong permanet wrap.

To save yourself a lot of work with the temporary wraps, I would suggest you get the bow's back and sides to their finish state after appling a good belly taper. Good luck.

ART

Posts: 1585 | From: Lansing, WVa | Registered: Jan 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Frank
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I've made bows with cracks like those, in osage only.

I would follow what Art says. If it was me, I'd def. sinew wrap when done. I've done this on a few ponybows and they performed just fine.

Frank

Posts: 858 | From: North Georgia | Registered: Mar 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
NightHawk
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Like Tom I think I'd find another piece of wood to work with

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1) Gen. 21:20
And God was with the lad, he grew, and he dwelt in the wilderness, and he became an archer
2)The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are willing to work and give to those who would not.
Thomas Jefferson

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Eric Krewson
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You can make the stave work with a bunch of superglue but if the stave were mine I would consign it to the scrap pile. You will never trust a bow made with that stave.
Posts: 4080 | From: Florence Alabama | Registered: Mar 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Shaun
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I'll take it off your hands. Longitudinal cracks do not bother me. If they are solid on the back and open on the belly, you won't have much left when you thin down to 1/2 thick limbs. I would rough it down to floor tiller stage and see what it looks like. Filling with CA (super) glue has always worked for me.

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www.taurusbows.com

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Art B
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Lots that can be learned yet even if it doesn't work out for you. I would have at it.

You might want to go ahead and do some inital heat straightening before you fill in those cracks. Maybe leave the handle section for last as far as filling in to help with alignment. Heating can loosen you glue bond and produce fumes from the super glue, so be aware of that. ART

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Walt Francis
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What Eric said!

Can it be done? Maybe, I would have to hold/feel and inspect the stave with checks before giving a recommendation. I have made bows with wood that appears similar to that in the picture.

Should it be attempted? That is a decision only you can make. I think if you thought it should be attempted, you wouldn’t be asking us for validation. Here is what I do when making a selfbow: Compare the cost of starting with a good stave to the cost and amount of time spent making the bow. Then decide if it is worth my time and the increased risk of hurting the shooter if it explodes when used.

When I first started making selfbows I took the risk, some times with good to excellent results, but also had a couple of them explode; Luckily there were no injuries (other then pride). Now I throw stuff like that away. Also, when I quit using questionable wood for selfbows my success/survival rate for them increased dramatically.

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The broadhead used, regardless of how sharp, is nowhere as important as being able to place it in the correct spot.

Walt Francis

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Roy Steele
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I'd set it back later if I low on bow wood I would fill with super glue and back it.I no longer back bows so I make fire wood from it.

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DEAD IS DEAD NO MATTER HOW FAST YOUR ARROW GETS THERE
20 YEARS LEARNING 20 YEARS DOING 20 YEARS TEACHING
CROOKETARROW

Posts: 1124 | From: WV | Registered: Jan 2009  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
John Sturtevant
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I can’t tell enough from the pics to say what your chances are with that piece of wood.

When I was wood poor and wealthy in desire to learn all I could about bow making I would use wood like that…..and made some bows from time to time that shot great and held together. Now I would pass...too much good wood available.

Since your asking the question I’m guessing you’re more interested in learning then if you end up with a bow. If that’s the case I’d suggest you go ahead and see what it can teach you. Just do it safely...pulley and rope tillering tree where you can stand back and safety glasses and a nut cup when drawing by hand. [Smile] Kidding...kinda….
Just keep in mind that exploding bows can hurt you...but even those with seemingly clean wood can let go from time to time so it shouldn’t stop you from going ahead and having fun.

What’s a good analogy?
Maybe the early stages of bow building are like the early stages of chasing women.
You’re not so worried about the quality of women you catch at first..you don’t plan on keeping them anyway...you just want to learn how to catch them and then learn what they're all about when you do. Later on you get a bit more picky. Hopefully.
That’s probably a poor comparison... [Smile]

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Bjorn
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If it were just the handle that would be OK to fill with Loctite 420, in my opinion. That area has lots of wood in it. I would worry about the limb, even if it doesn't break it would act like a plague during shooting.
Like John suggests above, you may want to play catch and release with that one.

Posts: 9987 | From: Los Gatos, California | Registered: Jun 2005  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
frank bullitt
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Bjorn, you might want to ask your "Teacher" John. I have a pic from many years ago of a Buffalo Runner bow he made. It has wrappings all over the limbs. I'm guessing "cracks"!

Troy, like said, you could hold on to it until your more comfortable with it. Or you can continue, and possibly have a shooter. Or worse firewood!

This is bow wood, not your car, not your home! Nothing to chance but experience and maybe something more.

Without failure there is no Success!

Good shootin, Steve.

Posts: 2300 | From: mighty wabash river,in. | Registered: Aug 2008  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
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